tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post1767777694051630187..comments2023-11-03T01:45:11.288-07:00Comments on Lost Garden: Project Horseshoe Report: Building Innovative Games that SellDaniel Cookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10437870541630835660noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-24194854388486779192007-03-26T10:23:00.000-07:002007-03-26T10:23:00.000-07:00This looks strikingly like the good ol' spiral met...This looks strikingly like the good ol' spiral methodology of prototyping.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-17791234697652527162007-03-13T13:42:00.000-07:002007-03-13T13:42:00.000-07:00I think you are confused with Mario Club. Mario C...I think you are confused with <I>Mario Club</I>. <I>Mario Club</I> isn't a playtest group, but the entire testing dept. NOA has the <I>Mario Club</I> which does the daily testing of project, and then there is the <I>Tree House</I> which goes into more detail and design. NCL might have a different system.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-6651226899243719182007-02-26T12:14:00.000-08:002007-02-26T12:14:00.000-08:00All the games released from the game industry coul...All the games released from the game industry could be successful if they'd just produce about 80% fewer of them. :) <BR/><BR/>--RayRaymondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07035842500415940617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-70405224680462200492007-02-04T13:39:00.000-08:002007-02-04T13:39:00.000-08:00Appreciate the comments.
Re: Mario Club. This so...Appreciate the comments. <br /><br /><b>Re: Mario Club.</b> This sort of user testing points out one of the big 'success criteria' that the market leaders have known for quite some time. Games that play test well tend to be pretty good games. :-) It's a rather obvious observation, yet many companies still struggle with not having testable games until very late in their development cycle. <br /><br />The best testing setups tend to involve watching users directly, but there is still a lot to be gained from remotely recorded play sessions. Indie developers with access to existing customers (say from a previous game) have some useful options with beta tests, forums and remote logging. <br /><br /><b>re: Joe's essay</b><br />Appreciate the link. I cross posted this comment on your site as well, but thought it fit here also. <br /><br />You've made a leap here and fundamentally mischaracterized a stage gate process as just another name for waterfall development methodologies. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. You can use stage gate with waterfall. You can use it with agile. I personally feel it fits agile development much better and you'll see that more evolved stage gate process have a striking similarity to many agile technique even though you find them in non-software industries. <br /><br />As you may know from my other essays, I'm a huge fan of various agile process and put a big emphasis on both prototyping and rapid iteration. The stage gate process maps quite nicely onto practices like Scrum or XP and brings a lot of common lessons to the table<br /><br /><b>Start small:</b> Do the simplest thing possible that gives you critical information. You may learn something. <br /><b>Don't put all your eggs in one basket:</b> Try out multiple ideas early on. Since you can't know which ideas will pan out, it makes a lot of sense to try several and then invest further in the promising ones. <br /><b>Test regularly:</b> The whole point of the stage gate process is to have formal testing and validation *throughout* the development process, not at the end. <br /><b>Understand what success looks like:</b> Even the most rapid iterative process is useless if you are making random changes that do no improve the product. By understanding what success looks like, you can iteratively guide your products towards that that goal. <br /><b>Invest late, not early:</b> Product development is a learning process. You might as well invest money as you discover success mechanics, settings, etc instead of dumping a wad on hand waving specs early on. <br /><br />It is also worth noting that just because there are big formal stages that are used for large scale portfolio management, there is nothing in the process that rejects the hundreds or thousands of iterative loops within each development stage. In fact, I'd recommend it since it helps teams meet the gate criteria more successfully. <br /><br />Stage gate has some serious potential for helping us create innovative product. It brings portfolio management out of the darkness of Skull&Bones green lighting committees and encourages that smart companies set aside money to build new-to-the world, high payoff products. <br /><br />It is worth taking another look at the concept and imagining how it might fit into the iterative work flow you so rightly target as critical to success in our industry. I'm guessing you'll be pleasantly surprised at how the two compliment each other. <br /><br />Appreciate the article and the opportunity to start a conversation. :-) <br /><br />take care<br />Danc.Daniel Cookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10437870541630835660noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-14921312183225762642007-02-04T11:42:00.000-08:002007-02-04T11:42:00.000-08:00I just posted my thoughts on the Project Horseshoe...I just posted <a href="http://programmerjoe.com/2007/02/04/stage-gates-are-wrong-for-games/">my thoughts</a> on the Project Horseshoe report. I don't think stage gates are really the answer, mostly because , as you write above, game development is an iterative process. Stage gates are not an iterative model: They have a series of fixed stages that a product goes through from idea to release with fixed exit criteria for each stage.<br /><br />I think something like the Mario Club in the first comment plus an iterative process at the high level would be much more useful.<br /><br />Anyway, there's the link if you're interested. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11719805.post-22245901522584328962007-01-25T12:39:00.000-08:002007-01-25T12:39:00.000-08:00Wow, that's really cool about the playtesting grou...Wow, that's really cool about the playtesting group.<br /><br />It makes me wonder if there could be an Internet community group like that available for all of us indie developers.Clinthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05919109761994692487noreply@blogger.com